Meeting Minutes >> February 2005 Minutes
February 2005 Minutes


Meeting Minutes




Board Members Present:


Monty Clark

Ruth Reynolds

Ted Gartman

Larry Flannery

Thalia Ellis

John McGee

Marti Miller

Christine Covington


Board Members Not Present:


Monty started the meeting identifying we needed to make sure that all cellular telephones had been turned off or were on vibrate. He identified we have been having many problems with members not honoring that request. There is a $5.00 fine each time your cellular phone went off. He pointed out several times we have had speakers and have had the meetings interrupted by cell phones.

Secretary's Report - Christine Covington 

Christine identified that the Annual Meeting minutes have been posted to the website. 

Christine also identified that the constitution changes that were voted on at the last meeting have been updated on the website.

She also stated that all membership certificates have been mailed as of 16 February 2005.

Christine has removed all members who have not renewed from the website and the NCAPI newsgroup as of 31 January 2005.

Christine stated she had sent invitations to any members who were not already a member of the NCAPI newsgroup. We have already had 17 new members this week.

Christine pointed out that during our previous insurance discussions over the montsh, she had been in contact with El Dorado Insurance Company. When they heard about our insurance situation, they had been very interested. They were not licensed to sell insurance in North Carolina, but went about getting licensed and were working on getting a price structure. They sent an email this week and identify they are ready to write. Christine will follow up with them to find out their cost structure. 

Christine identified the board had made a decision about 2nd listings. With a 4 to 3 vote it will cost only 1/2 price for a 2nd listing. You do need to have a physical location.

We will be sending an email to all PI's holding a NC license about the topics for the PI's want in a continuing education program. 

In regards to Advertising, we need to see if we can get all PI's on the same page about trying to drop one of the headings we are listed on. It was discussed that we seem to be one of the only industries that are being double charged for listings. All other industries have a "see listings under _____" topic. (Example, you wont find a listing under Doctor. It will say, "see listings under Physicians")

Motion to accept.

Treasurers Report - Marti Miller

$808.30          Pac Fund
$3520.00        Lobbyist Fund
$16,136.51     Checking
$20,464.81     Total Funds

Marti has written several checks that have not cleared yet. She also states she has written Christine a $100.00 check for supplies. 

$2900.00 has been deposited, but has not been updated in the totals. Marti identified that Christine made a deposit from the renewals and membership. Instead of waiting for Christine to forward a group of checks to Marti and then Marit make the deposit, we have found it faster to have Christine just make the deposit.

Motion to Accept.

Ethics & By-Laws - Larry Flannery

Larry stated he does not have a report at this point. However, he does state if you know of any unlicensed activity, please advise him so he can forward a complaint to the PPSB.

It was discussed that there is a company in Georgia that is advertising on for employees to work in North Carolina. They seem to think that by getting the case at the corporate offices in Georgia, reciprocity will allow them to have investigators come into North Carolina to do the work without NC licenses.


Motion to Accept.

Training & Education  - Thalia Ellis


Thalia wanted to let us know that she was present at the Training and Education PPSB subcommittee meeting. She pointed out the upcoming changes to the Fire Arms Trainer program and the Unarmed Guard trainer certifications.

Unarmed Guard  - The PPSB has identified that they will be providing workshops for all current Unarmed Guard Trainers. If the trainer does not complete one of these workshops, they will lose their certification when the new program goes into effect. The schedule on the workshops should be finalized within the next couple of weeks.


Fire Arms Trainer course will be offered 16-20 May. The new cost structure will be in place. $125.00 plus room/board.


The PPSB had created a sub-committee to address less than lethal weapons like tasers. Grimes, Miles and Blanks are on the sub-committee.

There was discussion from a member that they are trying to set up a school to train unarmed guards.


The PPSB is looking over the training manual for Armored Car Couriers. The will update the PPSB at the next meeting.


There was discussion about how best to notify our members of upcoming Fire Arms training courses. For the time being, we will be updating the Swap/Shop with training courses.

There is no extension on firearm qualifications. If you fail to renew/re-qualify by the expiration, you are required to go through the full qualification.


Motion to Accept.

Legal & Legislative  - John McGee


John and Bill Fletcher met on 26 January 2005 at the swearing in of the new NC Legislature. They met with many of the members who are directly responsible for issues that are confronting us. (All the members of the committee of the 74C rewrite).


17 February 2005, Cindy Gunther, Marti Miller, Bill Fletcher, Ruth Reynolds, and John McGee all went to meet with Speaker of the House Jim Black. It was a good discussion. He seems to be responsive to our issues.

There was a discussion about needing to get input from the membership about what we think needs to be corrected in the 74C rewrite.


A member wanted to know if the Governor could be given more appointees and if we could change 74C to demand they be industry members.


The current 74C rewrite is scheduled to drop the board members from 14 to 9.

A member asked if the NCAPI had an attorney. When it was identified we do not, it was asked, “Why not?” Monty explained that we have not had sufficient funds to look at hiring an attorney. We had been looking at hiring a lobbyist/attorney, but the costs were too high.


Motion to Accept.

Membership  - Ted Gartman


We are still looking to expand the website. However, we are still in discussion with Clickcom about costs.


Ted identified he had been about to send an email out to all PI’s holding NC licenses. He has pulled that email and will be getting in touch with Rick Clayton to work on a new list of possible topics for Continuing Education. We will find out what our industry the PI’s feel are important.

Ted had made nametags for the members to make it easier for members to get to know one another.


Our current statistics are:


16 New

5 Associate Members

2 Staff Members

72 Removed

143 Current Members


Motion to Accept


Past President  - Ruth Reynolds


Ruth wanted us to know that she is continuing with a couple of projects from last year.


Basic Investigator course  - In May 2005, the PPSB wanted to raise the required hours from 3000 hours to progress from Associate to PI.


We have been working to develop a course for potential PI Associates. We have been in close contact with the 57 community colleges to determine interest and capability. 

It looks like a 40-hour program covering topics like Legal Issues, Ethics, and Report Writing will be the best option.


This will only be required of people looking to become Associate Private Investigators. The course would need to be completed prior to application for a PIA license.


Continuing Education  - Mandatory CE is coming. The NCAPI is working to develop CE that the membership and the industry need. We are currently the only one certified by the PPSB to provide CE.

Rick Clayton  - Rick discussed the fact that most of the courses we are proposing are already spelled out in the basic law enforcement courses.


This would be a 40-hour certificate course.

Our next step is to work on development of lesson plans.

Insurance  - Russ Thomas received a letter from Mr. Raymond Bell on the behest of Mr. Talley about insurance. They are with the NC Insurance Commission. They identified insurance is not required by NC statute.



They have since reversed position. They now state there is a statutory requirement for insurance on PI’s.


We have asked the North Carolina Insurance Commission for assistance. We are hoping they can help us find a North Carolina insurance carrier that will write policy for North Carolina PI’s instead of our money going out of state.

Ruth will be setting an appointment to have further discussions about our situation.

Russ pointed out that his insurance (and he wants us to check our own policy) identifies that it is not a North Carolina certified policy. Therefore it does not pay into the NC insurance fund so if the carrier goes bankrupt, we will be afforded no protection. 



Continuing Education – NCAPI is currently the only one the board had approved to offer CE.

There will be a two-tiered cost structure to offering CE. There will be one price for NCAPI members and a higher cost for non-NCAPI members.


Our numbers keep growing. Once CE is mandated, our numbers should explode. The larger our Associations numbers, the larger voice we have to accomplish things with the PPSB.

The seminars we have provided in the past have given us credibility with the PPSB.


It was pointed out that the pricing error with the Quality Suites had been corrected. Just to let everyone know, they had always agreed to honor the government rate.

$57.25 per single

$74.00 per double.

Bubba Russo – Data Card Group, Smith Addressing


Bubba came to talk to us about our credentials. He stated they have a product that offers a secure way to produce our credentials.


Their product is supplied, built and manufactured by them. Their cards can be equipped with many security features from phantom photos to holograms.


They can provide a via-net product that can be accessed from multiple points via web technology.

They currently provide their products to Lucent Technologies, Ford Motor company, NASA, and the Department of Defense.


They have 2 sizes of plastic cards that can be provided. They can come in a business card size or a larger, CR100 size.


Marti called for a vote on the size of our request to the PPSB for our credentials.


1 – Business card (Drivers license size) – 0 votes

2 – CR100 (largest they can provide in plastic) – 21 votes

3 – Current credential size (not plastic) – 0 votes

We agreed that the plastic cards are the best alternative. They are less expensive to produce and the PPSB can have multiple versions for different license types.

Presidents Report – Monty Clark


Monty discussed the Insurance issue again. He stated we have been working as an Association to try to find the answers. We have found about a dozen insurance carriers that will write more reasonable policies.

If anyone has a reasonable insurance policy, please forward the information to Christine.

Yellow page advertisement. Monty came back to the Yellow page advertisement issue to point out that this is another time someone in our industry has shot us in the foot. A PI was upset around the 1980’s. He did not wish to be called a Detective. He demanded a listing under PI. The Yellow Pages obliged him. Now we will have an unbelievable time trying to get ourselves listed in just one place.


74C rewrite  - Monty pointed out that at the PPSB meeting it was discussed that 74C has been tabled at the NC Legislature.

We still have things we need to address with the re-write. The concern of some members was that the tone from Carlton is that his only interest is moving the existing 74C re-write forward. He does not seem interested in looking at any alterations.


One member brought up that this would be a perfect time to add the “certificate” for associates to the 74C. He further suggested that all PI’s (not just Associates) be required to take that course.

Marti pointed out that Georgia and Tennessee require all PI’s to take a test.


Monty states that we will have to revisit the 12 points of interest that we had from the original 74C rewrite topics.


He believes we need to form a committee to discuss the points we need to try to pursue with the board.

Christine brought up that this would be the time we need to try to bring 74C into the data age. We need to address computers, database technology, computer forensics, and equipment.

Seminars - We will be working on putting on 2 seminars this year. We are looking at tentative dates of June & September. Once we determine exact dates and topics, we will forward to the membership.


Our next meeting will be in April in Wilmington. (Exact location has not been confirmed). Further details will be updated as soon as we have it.

Superconference  - The Superconference will be held 3-8 May in Myrtle Beach, South Carolina.

It will be at the Marriott Resort, Myrtle Beach.


The cost for the seminar is $195.00.


The Marriott has a negotiated rate for us at $130.00 per night. (You have to book your hotel directly with them. Identify you are with the Superconference) Call 843-449-8880.


We are still working on the Vendor list, but we will have a variety. Vendors range from NALI, to Info-brokers, to Database providers, to equipment resellers, etc.

South Carolina is giving 18 CE credits for the seminar.


It will be a great time. Bring your spouse or significant other (even family).

Motion to Adjourn.





Members Present


Darrell Latham                         Latham Confidential Svc

Cindy Gunther                         G & G

Thalia Ellis                               Progressive Investigations

Larry Flannery                         Scott & Associates

Audra Coleman                        Cameo Investigations

Barbara Bacon                        Cameo Investigations

Rick Clayton   

Harris Kern                              Brockwell Investigations

Rex Lilly                                   Allied Protection & Inv.

Arthur Duffy                               

Jeff Kiker                                 Kiker Investigations

Fred McKinney                        SouthEastern Inv.

David Chavis                           IBS/ Security

Larry Alexander                       Alexander National Security

Jon Lloyd                                Alexander National Security

Frank Kiker                              Kiker Investigations

Chad Sigmon                           SSA Security

Marti Miller                               A-1 Services

Ruth Reynolds                        Reynolds Professional Svc.

Monty Clark                            Clark & Associates

Ted Gartman                           N-Focus Investigations

John McGee                           McGee Investigations

Ed Blake                                 Blake Investigations

Russ Thomas                         TAICS, Inc.

Rick Eatmon                           Eatmon & Assoc.

Hayden Church                      TrackUm & Assoc.

Christine Covington                Blake Investigations

Tim Reynolds                         Probe

McCoy Faulkner                     Faulkner Detective Agy.

J. Hetnick                               CLT

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